Even the US President concedes that Barnaby was right –
President Barack Obama, on a cross-country trip to sell his deficit reduction plan, said yesterday that the nation’s finances are “unsustainable.”
“We have an unsustainable situation,” he said. “We face a critical time where we are going to have to make some decisions – how do we bring down the debt in the short term, and how do we bring down the debt over the long term?”
Barnaby Is Right 
The origins of carbon trading and trading in water, national parks and marine reserves (debt for nature swaps) can be found below:
T H E M O N E Y C H A N G E R
Vol.1, No.6, December, 1987
Information deadline December 1, 1987
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F.Sanders,S.P.,MONEYCHANGER*5705 Stage Rd., Suite 164*Memphis,TN.38134
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THE FOURTH WORLD WILDERNESS CONFERENCE:
Beware the bankers bearing gifts
An interview with Mr. George Hunt
Mr. George Hunt has been an accountant for small businesses, corpo-
rations, and partnerships for the past 18 years, specializing
in physicians and dentists. He works also with general businesses,
doing consulting, accounting, and tax work as well as
investment counselling. He kindly made time for this interview
on November 18, 1987.
MONEYCHANGER – What was the Fourth World Wilderness Congress
that took place September 11th through September 18th?
HUNT – It was billed as a world-wide meeting to address global
environmental concerns. As far as the public was concerned, it was
produced by a chap named Ian Player, a wealthy, wealthy in-
dustrialist of (I believe) English descent. I’m sure he’d be in
Who’s Who and so on. As I found out it was not really produced
by him, but by the moneychangers in London and Europe.
MONEYCHANGER – That is a far-reaching charge. What basis do you
have for that?
HUNT – Well, the London banker Baron Edmund de Rothschild
was at the meeting for 6 days. Edmund de Rothschild was personally
conducting the monetary matters and creation of this World
Conservation Bank (WCB), in the company of I. Michael Sweatman
of the Royal Bank of Canada. Those 2 were like Siamese twins,
and that’s why I say that it appears they were running at least
the money side of this conference, and I would say the conference
was primarily to get money. Also, David Rockefeller was there, and gave a speech on Sunday.
MONEYCHANGER – How many people were there?
HUNT – There were 1500 from 60 countries sign up at the first
meetings in Denver. That was first 3 days before it went up
into the mountains, where the shirtsleeve work was done.
MONEYCHANGER – Into the mountains where?
HUNT – We went up to Estes Park, Colorado from Monday through
Friday, after the meetings the preceding Friday through Sunday
afternoon at Currigan Hall in Denver. Rockefeller spoke that
Sunday and there were keynote addresses about how great
this whole idea was. Then we adjourned to the YMCA camp facility
in Estes Park for another 5 days of meetings.
MONEYCHANGER – What whole idea?
HUNT – Oh, conservation, ecology, the world has a chance, we’re
going to beat the ozone deterioration, we’re going to get
the rain forests back together again. The thing that really
set me off was Baker’s talk.
MONEYCHANGER – Was he there?
HUNT – Oh yeah, he was there. He gave the keynote address.
He said that conservation requires “growth and development”.
There was a HUM around the audience, because they knew that “growth
and development” are antagonistic to conservation.
MONEYCHANGER – Wait now. There are some code words passing here,
aren’t there? When Baker says something like that, he’s talking
in code about something else.
HUNT – Exactly. He’s talking in code about the *formula*,
the “equation” of conservation and growth and development,
that is, assets equals liabilities plus net worth. There were
a lot of these *double intendres*.
MONEYCHANGER – How did you get in to these meetings?
HUNT – I was watching public television one night before the
congress. A week earlier my 21 year old son had said to me, Dad,
you know I’d like to go up to the Arctic and repair the rangers’
huts up there. They need repair and I could do it, and I’d
like to be up there alone. So I filed that away. Then as I was
watching public television they announced that the Fourth World
Wilderness Congress as coming to Denver Sept. 11th. They
showed pictures of reindeer and all that kind of stuff. I said,
Gee, that would be great, I bet I could rub elbows with the Smokies
(the U.S. Forest Service) there, which I did by the way. There
were 90 smokies there.
So I got on the phone, and because I’m a businessman and have
a sales background, too, I was able to wangle myself in, free
of charge. There was a F$650 charge for attending.
MONEYCHANGER – Wait a minute. You’re telling me that all these
GREENIES who live out in the woods on berries and nuts came
up with F$650 plus travel to Denver?
HUNT – A good question. I think a lot of those Greenies were
sponsored to be there. It was a contrived conference. So I called
around and it turned out that the FINDHORN GROUP in Loveland,
CO, were the official hosts. They call themselves “The Emissaries.”
MONEYCHANGER – Aren’t they an occultist New Age group?
HUNT – Heavy New Age, but they were in charge of the host functions
at the Congress, and I finally wound up being interviewed
by them. I told them I was a Christian, I was transparent with
everybody. Turns out that a Christian within their group — you
know, New Age includes Christians, too, they’re just off on
a little tangent maybe — interviewed me and I was passed
with flying colors as a good guy to meet and greet these attendees.
My job was to act as a host to the dignitaries, coming in from
various parts of the world. I loved my work, because I love people,
and I did a good job for these folks.
When my work was through, I sat in on all of the meetings that
were of a business nature. Baker got up and spouted his “conserva-
tion requires growth and development” line, and a lot of other
things. I’ve got a copy of his speech, and it sounded good if you
just listened to the words, but it was cloaked with a lot of
innuendos. I said to myself, this is a SCAM. Here’s the 1st
speaker, and immediately I was alerted, because I know the history
of these people.
MONEYCHANGER – “These people” means bankers and money people,
or New Agers, or who?
HUNT – Bankers and money people. I’ve delved into conspiracy.
I don’t know where you’re coming from on this, but I checked
it out and researched it for 5 years and I am *convinced* there
is a conspiracy.
MONEYCHANGER – Well, at the very least some kind of Insider network
that arranges things to their own benefit.
HUNT – James Baker is the Edward Mandell House of
the U.S. Treasury Department. So I wrote an open letter
of rebuttal to distribute at the meeting the next day. I printed
700 letters. Thank God I didn’t distribute them. The thing
that caused me not to distribute it, besides fear, was compassion.
When I saw Rothschild and Rockefeller sitting up in front before
Rockefeller’s talk, I thought, Would you want someone to do
that to you, George, distribute a rebuttal that makes you
look silly, when you’re a national figure?
As it turns out my distributing that wouldn’t have any
impact *at all* on that audience because they were either ig-
norant or bought. But I went back to the pressroom after Rockefel-
ler’s speech, and presented it to him — to his bodyguard really,
his bodyguard up between me and David. He did read it, because
the next da I received a warning from Rockefeller’s office
that I’d better stop politicking or I’d regret it. Which
was good for me, since it made me shut my mouth and open my
ears. I was warned by the Findhorn Group, and I complied. It
was good that I was obedient to my superiors, because
I was allowed to stay at the congress and hear a lot of interest-
ing things.
After the talks for the public and the newspapers were finished
on Sunda afternoon, we went up to the shirtsleeves sessions in
Estes Park. I had lunch with Michael Sweatman and Mr. and Mrs.
Rothschild, and I was able to ask them how this bank was going
to continue to operate***
MONEYCHANGER – By “this bank” you mean the WCB?
HUNT – Yes. I didn’t see any earnings engine inside it. Where
are the earnings coming from, if all you have in it are these
wilderness lands, reindeer hides, and so on? I didn’t say exactly
that, but***
MONEYCHANGER – Reindeer hides don’t pay much of a dividend.
HUNT – No. They’re planning on re-financing, debt swapping one trillion dollars of Third World debt into this
new World Conservation Bank. I told a high official of the
Brazilian finance ministry, Dr. Jose Pedro de Oliveira-Costa,
I don’t see how this bank is going to survive. Is this really
going to benefit Brazil?
He sad, last night I could not sleep all night long. There is no
benefit that anybody’s going to get from this bank. If they
give us a refinance, in the short run, yes, we will benefit.
We will get soft currency from them, we’ll be able to get our
economy going again, but in the long term, he said, we won’t
be able to pay those loans back. We’ve devalued as far as we
possibly can in our country, we’re at the brink of poverty.
MONEYCHANGER – Well, how did Sweatman answer the question of
where the earnings would come from?
HUNT – He said, “We’re working on that.”
MONEYCHANGER – . “We’re working on that”??
HUNT – “We’re working on that.” He’s an evasive guy. In fact,
he’s already lied to Senator Tim Wirth .
MONEYCHANGER – How will this World Conservation Bank scheme
work exactly?
HUNT – The WCB will be enacted by the United Nations, and will
need to be approved, I wuld think, by every country participating.
Let’s assume that our senators and representatives allow
this thing to happen. Then the Bank will be endowed with 30%
of the earth’s land surface.
MONEYCHANGER – Now WHO is going to do that? Governments around
the world will give title to their wilderness lands to th WCB?
HUNT – Will give title to the lands to the World Wilderness
Land Inventory Trust. It will be en-trusted. Sounds good, huh?
We know about trusts.
Then this Trust will go floating into the WCB by the unanimous
decree of the world’s people, saying, God Bless you for
saving our reindeer. That kind of a mentality is where they’re
coming from. Those people at the congress were ignorant. They
don’t suspect anything. They’re VERY naive. Not stupid, ignorant.
MONEYCHANGER – Which people do you mean?
HUNT – I’m talking about the conservationists. Conservationists
and ecologists comprised about 60% of the people there. About
30% were government, United Nations and other bureaucrats. The other
10% were world banking heavyweights who were there with axes
to grind and pencils to sharpen.
So the bank is endowed with an asset, an asset worth how many
trillions? I don’t know. Their accountants are going to evaluate
this 50 million sqaure kilometer hunk of wilderness lands. then the
WCB will have the power to act as a world central bank. It can
create soft currencies, not hard currencies, at this point. Soft
currencies are used, as you probably know, for some purpose WITHIN
a country. But what I picked up on is that the soft currencies
can be spent outside of a country for environmental and ecological
equipment. Well, hello, International Harvester, Mack Truck,
etc., they’re going to bring those soft currencies into the
US and we’re going to have inflation.
MONEYCHANGER – That will be an international currency, in other
words. You’re calling it a soft currency, but in effect it’ll
be an international currency.
HUNT – It’s not an international currency in the sense
of a one world currency because it’s not a hard currency,
it’s not legal tender for all international transactions, yet.
Now you know and I know that by currency and debt-for-equity
swaps they’re going to wheel and deal it from soft into hard
somehow. These guys are smart.
MONEYCHANGER – Let me see if I understand. A World Conservation
Bank will be set up and into a trust will be vested title
to 30% of the world’s land surface, 12 1/2 *billion* acres. Against
this the WCB will issue loans to various countries to buy,
what did you say, environmental***
HUNT – No, no, no, they could issue loans, but I’m talking
specifically about currencies. They can create currencies
for in-country use.
MONEYCHANGER – Well, that’s issuing loans. It’s the same thing.
They will loan money for certain spceified purposes to these
countries. Now am I to assume that say, for example, Brazil,
puts up the Amazon Basin, and they get credited a certain amount?
Then there’s a certain amount of loans they can draw down
against that “deposit”, so to speak?
HUNT – How it will work I’m not sure. They didn’t get into technique,
they went into policies and enactments and resolutions. BUT,
there could be a gradual loan swap for Brazil, taking them out
of their old loans and putting them into a new WCB loan,
which will then sweeten the loan on the Chase Manhattan’s balance
sheet, and will take it out of non-accrual and put it back into
the healthy loan column once again.
MONEYCHANGER – or else pay it off.
HUNT – Or they could pay it off, right. They could call it any
shot that they wanted to. They could pay them off lickety-split.
MONEYCHANGER – But what’s really happened is that the Brazilians
will have given up title to millions of acres of land and in
exchange the Chase Manhattan will get its loan to Brazil
paid off by the WCB.
HUNT – You got it.
MONEYCHANGE – I got it.
HUNT – I believe that World Bank loans, as they stand now, are
not collateralized. Now they’re entering into a new era of loan
collateralization. They’re saying, Okay, the next step is that
we ant collateral, so that when we loan-swap this debt, and we’re
going to own the Amazon if you default. Remember, as the Brazilian
Oliveira-Costa sad, they’re not going to be able to pay that off.
That’s why he couldn’t sleep that night, because he *knew*
that they were going to loose the Amazon .
MONEYCHANGER – These are debt for equity swaps, which they’ve
been talking about for several years. They’re going to make
their bad loans good by collateralizing them after the fact
with all of this land, and somebody, somebody, SOMEBODY is going
to end up with title to *twelve and a half billion acres*.
Is that right?
HUNT – That’s right. The collateral behind whatever loans are
in the WCB at the time, if the WCB goes belly up. There’s a whole
see-saw of things that are going to happen. They have multi-,
multi-trillions of dollars upon which they can create currencies
and loans, and they’re going to begin to barter and counter-
trade and loan-swap against the United States.
MONEYCHANGER – Have you ever heard the name John Law?
HUNT – No.
MONEYCHANGER – Are you familiar with the French hyperinflation
during the French Revolution, 1792 – 1798?
HUNT – Oh, yeah, when they issued assignats!
MONEYCHANGER – Do you know what the assignats were? The assignats
were the ASSIGNMENTS of a mortgage on what were called the “na-
tional domains”, and those were confiscated (mostly church) lands
and properties. In other words, it was a scheme to *monetize*
land. Now, what you have just described to me as the World
Conservation Bank is a scheme to monetize land.
HUNT – Very good, sir. You are right. Now I reeber John Law.
Didn’t he convince the French in the 1720s to monetize land
in the Mississippi Bubble?
MONEYCHANGER – No, but he had come up with a land monetization
scheme and presented it to the Scottish parliament in about 1694,
and he was literally laughed out of the country for it.
But this is the same crooked scheme, and moreover it will
function was a world central bank, and out of that world
central bank there will grow a one-world flat currency system
at the same time. This scheme is like a box of Cracker Jacks:
it’s just loaded with prizes and nuts.
How will this project be put into effect? Will it be installed
under the auspices of the United Nations?
HUNT – I think so. There was a United Nations World Commission
on Environment and Development created in 1982 that published
what’s called the Brundtland Report, actually entitled
OUR COMMON FUTURE
Gro Harlem Brundtland is the prime minister
of Norway. She is the mother of four, 49 years old, and she
was at the conference. The UN said, Brundtland, Go for it! Find out
the conditions in our world. She came back with her study
and said, The conditions are *terrible*. The UN then said,
What do you recommend? And she said, I recommend a conservation
bank, dot dot dot***
Her report set the stage for unlimited enactments to take over
ecology, environmental and pollution laws throughout the world.
This includes international dictation to the US about its “smoke-
stack” industries.
So not only do we have a Bank forming as a result of the Brundtland
Report, but we also have a proposal for very harsh, quasi-spiritual
ecological laws for “Mother Earth”. You’re going to have a “Mother
Earth Comes First” mentality arising throughout the world
as a result of this legislation.
MONEYCHANGER – One is tempted to say a *Mother Earth cult*.
HUNT – It is already turning into a Mother Earth cult.
The Brundtland Report is the precipitating event for putting
the entire scheme into effect. Brundtland was there at the
conference on Thursday, and I saw her receive the enactments
and resolutions that they had created. I do not have a copy
of them. They went underground. Senator Wirth’s office
has been looking for them. He’s the only senator that has yet had
any kind of an interest in this. I kind of wonder if he’s just
prying for the benefit of those others, because Timmy’s been
a representative or senator since 1972, so you know he’s been
pretty well processed by the one-world people. Yesterday Tim
Mahoney from Tim Wirth’s office called me and said, I talked
to Michael Sweatman and Michael Sweatman sad they weren’t
really there at that conference to create a World Conservation
Bank.
I said, “What??” Mahoney said, They were just there to see what
could possibly be done in that area. I said, Hey, take a look
at that copy of Baker’s speech that I sent you. He told us on
the first day in his keynote address that the purpose of this
congress is to create a World Conservation Bank. You know, con-
gressmen and senators are looking for an excuse NOT to pry.
This is a hot item, they don’t want to touch it.
MONEYCHANGER – How fast are they moving? When will they try to
put this WCB into action?
HUNT – As soon as they can, because as Rockefeller said in his
speech, “the good news is that collapse f the monetary system
that was predicted by some regarding each of the major borrowing
countries has been resolved ‘temporarily’ by extending the debt.”
“Temporarily” — that means he wants some *permanent* solutions.
“They bad news is that lower petroleum prices in 1986
caused countries to renegotiate the schedule for debt repay-
ment again. The borrowing countries are in better shape because
interest cost of servicing the nearly F$400 billion in Latin
American debt is still enormous. One-third of Latin America’s
Export earnings are devoted to paying interest on this debt,
according to the Institute for International Economics in Washington.
Two-thirds of the nearly F$400 billion in debt is owed to a number
of commercial banks, including Chase Manhattan. Most are paying
only interest payments, not principal, and while economic conditions
have improved the countries still face political and structural
problems that could hamper repayment.”
As you will recall I talked to Oliveira-Costa, a Brazilian finance
ministry official, and he said, There is no way that we could
pay off that debt. So the bottom line says, We’re going to have
a financial collapse in our country if they DON’T get the WCB.
MONEYCHANGER – Then there’s not much time. But you don’t have
any idea what the actual time framework is.
HUNT – I tried to extract that. I had dinner with James MacNeill,
the Secretary General, UN Commission on Environment and Development
in Geneva. That’s the commission that Gro Harlem Brundtland
headed up which will present its report to the UN in which
all of these resolutions will be contained. Nobody’s been able
to find out where it is. I think they’re going to pull a little
Federal Reserve trick on us, you know, present it sometime
like midnight on December 25th, when nobody’s watching.
At the congress I said to Michael Sweatman, There is no earnings
engine in the balance sheet of this bank that I can see, and you’re
taking in wilderness properties and trillions of dollars
in bad debts. Where are the earnings going to come from to keep
this bank afloat? He answered, We’re working on that; you’ll
have a chance to express your concerns and your questions in a
half and hour at our caucus.
I said Sure, you’re going to call on me. This thing seems to be
contrived from the beginning to the end, frankly. He said,
No, I’ll call on you. I sad, “You promise?” He said, “I promise.”
He did not call on me. There was NO pro and con offered at
the caucus, it was just Baron de Rothschild spouting non-entities.
He said, Innovation is the key to the pollution problem. We need
growth and development. For instance, we have a CO2 problem.
I propose that we create large dry ice machines that will absorb
the CO2 from the atmosphere, and then take the dry ice
that we create and take it up to the polar ice cap to keep it from
melting.
MONEYCHANGER – Oh, come off it.
HUNT – I am NOT kidding. I said to myself, That guy has either
lost his mind, or***
MONEYCHANGER – (uncontrollable laughter and howling)
HUNT – ***or he is just *laughing* at us. Isn’t that something?
And by the way, I’ve got the whole conference on tape.
At the end of the caucus, Baron Rothschild, “You have decided.
This will be a second World Marshall Plan.” And I said to myself,
“Did we say *that*? Nobody said anything here.” When I got home
I realized the significance of what he had said. That will be a
resolution, because he wrote it on a resolution sheet, I saw
him do it. That means that the governments are going to guarantee
the debt of thw WCB. Now Russia was a lot of the wilderness
lands, and I see that Russia is going to get a lot of the
loans. When they default, and the US is going to be the turkey
again.
MONEYCHANGER – But still, in the end, SOMEBODY is going to end
up with title to those lands, and I suggest that these somebodies
are these same moneyed interests that were so much in evidence
at this Fourth World Wilderness Conference.
HUNT – Exactly, and they’re going to be in back of the bank loaning
currency and cash flow to the WCB to keep it alive, to give it
the *appearance* of profitability. The bank will be running
on an accrual basis. On paper it will be recognizing profits
received on interests, but the interests will NOT be coming in
because these countries cannot pay. So my hypothesis is that
the kings, capitalists, and moneychangers of the world will be
in the back of this bank in the position of *creditors*.
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For part 2 of this file, see OWGART1.003
— Mike Carrillo
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